[LOGGED] Named Signal Tags

DustinBoyle

Hello Team Troikatronix,

I was hoping to log a feature request that I hope would make the connection of actors much quicker and easier.

I do a lot of work in the installed AV field and I work with a lot of various commercial audio DSP devices that are very similar to the Isadora work flow. The concepts of having a blank slate with various processing blocks that you connect together with virtual cables being used to route the signal to anywhere you like has been around in that world for quite some time. Many of the various software packages I have used over the years allow for signals to be routed via named tags as well as drawn out lines. What is nice is that the named tags can be cut copied and pasted and can speed up connections when large numbers of links are needed.

Output tags can go to as many input pins as you like for quick control distribution. Currently I have to draw every line and route it as I go for large amounts of connections and it gets messy and cumbersome.

I do see how having named tags would make it difficult to drag actors onto lines for immediate effect, but feel that can be used when needed and usually doesn't require more than one line drawn.

I snapped a quick pic of an example I whipped up in QSC's Qsys software of different named tag examples

https://imgur.com/oQs7HEY

Is something like this possible in Isadora?

Thank you again for any assistance.

-Dustin

bonemap

Hi @DustinBoyle

I like your idea in principle, however after working through a few scenarios, I could see that this protocol could become quite difficult to implement. Firstly, it would require every output of every actor to have a unique identifier, for example if I have a series of actors with many dozens of outputs that are just labelled 'output' it would require a laborious process of creating unique id's for each one, or if automated, having unreasonably long tags to identify unique outputs. In a serious patch this would become even more unmanageable than the current workflow. I would have to say there would be some advantages with copy and paste tags with smaller patches. I could be missing something when looking at a larger patch file, but when I compare the current workflow, taking into account the features like the set of 'linking wire' keyboard shortcuts and operators like Matrix Value Send and Matrix Value Receive, the tagged output method starts to appear less viable. I am sure there is a way to make it work, and it may enhance the workflow in some circumstances, but I don't think the reality of implementing it as a solution is going to be in anyway simple for a system that is as open ended as Isadora.

Other than my own limitation to see how it would work, I really like the concept of cut and past output tags.

Best Wishes

Russell

DustinBoyle

@bonemap

Bummer, I was hoping it would be easier than that. I'll have to take your word on it that it would be more difficult than its worth. I do like the idea of it though, so if it ever becomes a possibility I'm sure it would be a welcome addition.

bonemap

@DustinBoyle said:

Bummer, I was hoping it would be easier than that

It is a great concept for Isadora - it might be easier than I think - let's see what the Isadora team say about it!

Best Wishes

Russell

DustinBoyle

@bonemap thank you Russell, I hope it is well received. Have a great evening.

DustinBoyle

@bonemap Another possible request if tags are not feasible would be to allow for the addition/subtraction of points to the drawn lines after they have been drawn. this way you could test the links before committing to large drawings. then if they work you can just reroute the line afterwards to fit how you like. Or redraw them to fit as the scene builds instead of deleting and redrawing them. I feel this at the very least would speed some things up and simplify them.

Thank you again, I really do appreciate you taking the time to provide some thoughts on this and to help look into it.

DustinBoyle

@bonemap I keep thinking about how there might be a unique Isadora way to approach this and I had an idea. What if instead of a tag to replace the line, there was a send actor that was just a simple input that connected via drawn line to any output pin type from another actor. Then, there was a virtual link ID it could be assigned with to a corresponding receive actor that could receive the first send actors input without a wire. You could then have as many receive actors as you needed and have a line drawn between them and input pins (if the pins accept the signal being sent) of another actor. This provide the best of both worlds and still allows you to drop in actors in between if necessary. Maybe that's a better method that fits more in line with Isadora's workflow?

jfg

@DustinBoyle

do you mean something like that?

best

Jean-François

fubbi

@jfg @DustinBoyle I was just gonna say. Just dump listeners in one user actor and broadcasters in another and you get exactly what you are looking for. You could pimp it with global variables or the data array actor if you want more functionality and the option to dump out files.

Kathmandale

While I appreciate you're looking for a much more sophisticated system than this, but a helpful bit of Isadora functionality that I overlooked for a long time is...

if you hold down the shift key when drawing your connections you can connect to multiple inputs. Not much use if you're adding lots of additional actors one by one but if you know what you're going to need when first building the patch or user actor it can save a lot of time

https://s3.amazonaws.com/img0....

DillTheKraut

It may not be exactly what you where looking for, but I remembered somebody already had done something like this and found it again.

https://community.troikatronix...

Another approache could be to use the global value actor.

DusX

@DillTheKraut

Just what I was about to add.
JSON, and User Actors combined can save you hundreds of connections in large setups.

DustinBoyle

This is all very cool I will have to go over the suggestions listed here. thank you everyone for chiming in. If I have any detailed questions I will reply to the posts.

DustinBoyle

@jfg Oh wow!! yes that appears to be what I had in mind. I will have to play with this more. I was searching for send/receive and along those lines.

Woland

There's also this: https://community.troikatronix.com/topic/5486/easy-snapshots-for-user-actors-with-user-actors-inside-them?_=1604665587727

DustinBoyle

@Kathmandale AH I did not know you could do this. Thank you for this bit of info, I am sure to find this helpful in the future.

DustinBoyle

@Woland I will have to dig into this later this weekend, this seems pretty neat. thank you for sharing this.